Is Rick Warren a False Teacher?



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  • Is Rick Warren a False Teacher?

    Just before his death, Francis Schaeffer wrote The Great Evangelical Disaster. In it he warned of mainline evangelicalism’s accommodation with theological liberalism and evolution. According to Schaeffer, the evangelical church had become a disaster, namely, by fearing to stand on the truth and contend for the faith. This trend continues as spiritual peril and confusion spread throughout America and the world. Discernment toward doctrinal error seems non-existent and the Biblical doctrine of separation from unbelievers, false teachers, and disobedient brothers is neither mentioned nor practiced.

    It is my conviction that spiritual disaster continues to be promoted by Rick Warren. Many of you know already that he is the lead pastor at the Orange County based mega-church Saddleback Church where the average weekly attendance is around 20,000. Warren has also authored a number of Christian books including the Purpose Driven Life and many others in the Purpose Driven series. His ministries extend around the world and Warren has been invited to speak at a number of events including and the inauguration of the secular President Barack Hussein Obama. With such an extensive outreach to the global community and in such public view of the media, Rick Warren has a special obligation to properly represent the orthodox Gospel and not another Gospel. What is Rick Warren teaching? Is it biblically accurate? Why is it so important to examine Mr. Warren?

    Rick Warren has influenced over 500,000 churches with his Church Growth Conference and The Purpose Driven Church. He has further influenced nearly every Christian home in America with The Purpose Driven Life. I must issue a warning that the great evangelical disaster Francis Schaeffer warned of is moving in fast forward, and I hope none of you will want to be a part of it, after you discover the truth. I pray that you will stand firmly on the truth revealed. Carefully study Rick Warren’s vision and understanding of his relationship to the church today.

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ID:	1669He has said, “I’m looking for a second reformation. The first reformation of the church 500 years ago was about beliefs. This one is going to be about behavior. The first one was about creeds. This one is going to be about deeds. It is not going to be about what does the church believe, but about what is the church doing. I am working toward a second Reformation of the church which could create a Third Great Awakening in our nation or world.”

    As Warren lifts himself up to be like the great Reformer Martin Luther or Jonathan Edwards, there are a number of frightening aspects to this statement. Rick looks and works for a “Second Reformation” or a “Third Great Awakening” but his are empty of doctrinal content. Both Martin Luther, the Reformer, and Jonathan Edwards, the great pastor of the Great Awakening, were grounded in biblical doctrine. According to Rick, however, this new reformation or awakening will not be about doctrine or creeds but about deeds. Warren’s awakening will not be based upon Jesus Christ’s atonement for sin by the shedding of His blood on the Cross for the forgiveness of sins. It will not be based on the necessity of repentance and faith to receive the precious gift of eternal life by grace alone through faith alone. Rather, it will be demonstrated through a social gospel of human works meeting human felt needs.

    Contrast Warren’s statement with the ministry of the Old Testament prophets, the New Testament apostles, or the work of the first century church. The early church believed in and “continued steadfastly in the apostles’ doctrine,” which was sound doctrine (Acts 2:42). Paul made his doctrine “fully known” and willingly suffered persecution and affliction because of it (2 Tim. 3:10-11). The early church had a clear body of doctrine and the New Testament calls this “The Faith” (1 Timothy 4:1; 6:12; Jude 3). They believed Jesus Christ was the virgin born Son of God who shed His blood on the cross for the sins of the world and rose bodily from the grave, and that He was coming again. The early church contended for this, called by Jude “The Faith”. Paul warned that “the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine: but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears” (2 Timothy 4:3, 4).

    The Apostle John tells us that “many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh,” and those that “abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God”…and “if there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed” (2 John 7-11). In other words, the basis for fellowship and unity in a New Testament church was sound doctrine. We are not to join in cooperative service or a working relationship with unbelievers and false teachers (2 Cor. 6:14-17). But Rick Warren has erased this standard and made his basis of fellowship one of behavior and deeds, and this will lead to a disastrous and godless Reformation.

    Rick Warren Ignores Separating from Unbelievers, Modernists, and Terrorist

    Warren’s works to institute a P.E.A.C.E. plan, an acronym that stands for Planting (and Partnering with) Churches, Equipping leaders, Assisting the poor, Caring for the sick, and Educating the next generation. On the surface, it is a model the Social Gospel would be proud of! It is not his purpose is wrong, but it is how he will fulfill this agenda that is clearly unbiblical. Rick Warren willingly works with anyone to fulfill this plan. In a PBS interview with Charlie Rose, he says, “You don’t have to change your beliefs for us to work with you. I don’t insist that a Muslim change his belief for me to work on poverty. I don’t even insist that a gay person has to change their beliefs.”

    In 2006, Warren visited the terrorist state, Syria, and gave aid and comfort to this foreign enemy of freedom and the Gospel of Christ. During his visit, Rick made no mention of “Syria's one-party police state, its political prisoners, its chambers of torture, its support for Hezbollah terrorism in Lebanon, and its continued devotion to the destruction of Israel." [Joseph Farah, World Net Daily, accessed July 3, 2008] His visit turned into a propaganda bonanza for the Syrian tyrants. Joseph Farah of World Net Daily exposed Warren’s misguided visit by writing:

    “But now that Rick Warren has traveled to and provided legitimacy to a hostile foreign government, presided over by a brutal fascist dictator who hates Jews, threatens Israel, subverts neighboring Lebanon, imprisons and terrorizes its own citizens and even kills them in massive numbers when they stand up in revolt – now I have to denounce this impostor in the strongest terms possible.” [Joseph Farah, World Net Daily, accessed July 3, 2008]

    The “P” in his peace plan essentially means therefore that he will partner with any individual, church, religion, or even terrorist state to fulfill this goal. 2 Corinthians 6:14 says, “Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? And what communion hath light with darkness?” Paul concludes, “Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you” (2 Cor. 6:17). Rick Warren disobeys this clear command. Although Jesus cared deeply about those who were suffering, he did not join with unbelievers to establish an earthly kingdom. While it is fine to help people who are destitute, we must also realize that we can never eliminate poverty. Jesus said in Matthew 26:11, “For ye have the poor always with you; but me ye have not always.”

    Did the Apostles enter into a city and work with the pagans and unbelievers to care for the sick or educate the next generation? The Apostles went into a city to bring the greatest “help” offered to any man. And this is not a new suit, a meal, or a class on reading. The greatest help you can give to any man is the Gospel of Jesus Christ (Acts 16:7-11). That was the message of Paul in Philippi, Athens, Corinth, Ephesus, or Rome. “For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to everyone that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek” (Romans 1:16). And it was this message that led to persecution and people hating him.

    For Rick Warren to work alongside homosexuals, Muslims, and Roman Catholics and other non-Christians care more about teaching reading or math than preaching the Gospel is full blown apostasy. Our mandate from God is to go into the world and preach the everlasting Gospel. This does not mean we ignore human suffering, for Jesus also leads us to provide material help to those in need, but this still is not our primary focus.

    Rick Warren Promotes New Age Spirituality

    New Age spirituality is essentially the belief that all the world’s religions are identical at the mystical level and therefore there can be unity among them. It is based on the lie that in the “center of your being is a point of nothingness which is untouched by sin … a point of pure truth …(which) is the pure glory of God in us”, and that it in everybody, according to a popular and well know Roman Catholic mystic, Thomas Merton. [Ray Yungen, Time of Departing (Silverton, OR: Lighthouse Trails Publishing Company), p. 58-59. ] In all his best-selling books and on his web site, Rick Warren endorses those who promote and practice New Age spirituality, such as pantheism (God is in all things), mysticism, centering prayer, contemplative prayer, and spiritual formations/disciplines (New Age prayer techniques).

    For example, in The Purpose Driven Church, Warren refers to many questionable movements as having a “valid message” for the church that God has used to be a “wake-up call” for the church. In The Purpose Driven Life Rick Warren enlarges his endorsement of New Age spirituality by citing a Roman Catholic mystic and Carmelite monk named Brother Lawrence as a person we should emulate in prayer. [Rick Warren, The Purpose Driven Life, (Grand Rapids, MI: Zondervan, 2002), p.88,] Brother Lawrence used a form of prayer that made him “dance violently like a madman” when he went into the “presence.” The Carmelite order of monks was heavily influenced by Teresa of Avila whose own thinking was affected by Jewish Kabbalistic mysticism.

    Warren recommends reading another Roman Catholic priest and mystic, Henri Nouwen, by promoting his books on his web site. Henri Nouwen teaches: “The God who dwells in our inner sanctuary is also the God who dwells in the inner sanctuary of each human being.” [Roger Oakland, Faith Undone (Silverton, OR: Lighthouse Trails Publishing Company), p. 89-90.] At the end of his life, Nouwen taught that “all paths lead to God.” [Ibid, p. 100.]

    At a recent seminar held at Saddleback where New Age spiritist/guru’s (Dr’s. Daniel Amen, Mark Hyman & Mehmet Oz) were brought in for a seminar promoting the kick-off for Saddleback’s new church-wide “health and diet plan” called the Daniel Fast. This so-called “God’s prescription plan for your health” takes quite a perversion of its namesake’s narrative to be legitimized as “biblical”. In reality this event was more than merely about a “diet and health plan”, deceptively so. Warren knows the accepted terminologies expected among Christians. He knows when and where to use it, and where not to. Whether he has an audience of one or of 10,000 he says what it wants to hear.

    In an article on his website entitled “Pastors need Solitude, Refreshment to Prepare for Ministry,” the author quotes Thomas Merton, who is a clear practitioner of New Age spirituality, and then he gives very clear New Age advice for prayer: “The power of silence and solitude has been recognized throughout the history of spiritual formation. It is the purposeful separation of ourselves from the world in order to place ourselves with God. The evil one assaults our senses with the material world to drown out the distant chords of eternity’s symphony. Only in silence can we move past the deafening roar of the world and hear the music of God.” [Accessed July 1, 2008 from an article entitled, “Pastors Need Solitude and Refreshment,”]

    Some of these expressions like “power of silence and solitude” and “spiritual formation” seem innocent, but they are phrases straight out of the New Age lexicon. The New Age movement teaches that God is in everyone and everyone is in God, and through silence, meditative trances, mystical experiences, breath prayers, centering prayers, and contemplative prayers, you can find what Thomas Merton himself said is that “point of nothingness which is untouched by sin” where “the pure glory of God (is) in us. It is in everybody.” That is a lie of the deceiver that undermines the truth of God, the Person, and work of Jesus Christ to redeem us on the cross. Galatians 1:6-9 clearly tell us to not give honor to anyone who preaches another Gospel. “As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed” (Galatians 1:9).

    Rick Warren Associates with False Prophets

    Rick Warren’s close association with Robert Schuller is well documented. For many years, Warren has yoked together with Schuller’s church growth conferences as a learner and a leader. Robert Schuller is heavily influenced by eastern religions, positive thinking, and is a false prophet in every sense of the word, denying original sin and the absolute need for forgiveness through Christ’s atoning blood. In 1997, Warren spoke at Schuller’s Institute for Successful Church Leadership. With Warren and Bill Hybels present, more than eighty gay and lesbian pastors and lay leaders from the Metropolitan Community Churches participated.

    How can a good shepherd sit down with such wolves? Jesus tells us to “Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves” (Matthew 7:15). Paul warned the Ephesian pastors that after he departed “grievous wolves” would enter among them, “not sparing the flock” (Acts 20:29). Through the ministry of Rick Warren, false teaching and teachers are invading the evangelical Church in droves.

    Rick Warren Uses Perversions of Scripture as if Truth

    Let’s consider just one glaring example among many bad paraphrases that Warren chooses to use in his sermons and books. Warren quotes Ephesians 4:6 in The Purpose Driven Life from a modern corrupted version the, New Century Version, which says of our God, “He rules everything and is everywhere and is in everything” (Ephesians 4:6). Here New Age teaching creeps into a perverted Bible translation. That God is in everything is the teaching at the heart of all New Age teaching. The Bible does not teach that God is in everyone, but that He indwells believers in the Lord Jesus Christ. This is also the offense of the cross that Warren seems so unwilling to accept. It could very well be that Warren uses this verse on purpose, to gain national popularity and he has been heavily influenced by Robert Schuller, who also is clearly immersed in New Age, or Eastern theology. Warren also repeatedly quotes the notoriously deficient paraphrase version like “The Message” by Eugene Peterson.

    Rick Warren Wrongly Interprets the Scripture

    Warren’s usage of various translations allows him to make the Bible say what he wants it to say rather than what it really says. In the following excerpt from The Purpose Driven Life, Warren quotes three people: Isaiah, Job, and Dr. Bernie Siegel. According to Warren, Isaiah and Job, both great and godly men are living “without God and without purpose.” Dr. Siegel, however, understands hope and purpose, and he is a leading New Age author and spokesman. Here is Warren’s twisted comment which makes Dr. Siegel more spiritual than either Job or Isaiah:

    Without God, life has no purpose, and without purpose, life has no meaning. Without meaning, life has no significance or hope. In the Bible, many different people expressed this hopelessness. Isaiah complained, “I have labored to no purpose; I have spent my strength in vain and for nothing.” Job said, “My life drags by – day after hopeless day” and “I give up; I am tired of living. Leave me alone. My life makes no sense.” The greatest tragedy is not death, but life without purpose.

    Hope is as essential to your life as air and water. You need hope to cope. Dr. Bernie Siegel found he could predict which of his cancer patients would go into remission by asking, “Do you want to live to be one hundred?” Those with a deep sense of life purpose answered yes and were the ones most likely to survive. Hope comes from having a purpose.” [The Purpose Driven Life, p.30-31.]

    First, hope does not come from merely a purpose, but hope comes from our God and Lord Jesus Christ as we wait for eternal life. Hope in God, dear friends, not merely a purpose! (Psalm 42:5; 1 Timothy 1:1; Titus 1:2; Romans 15:13; 1 Thessalonians 5:8). Secondly, Warren does not quote the context of those passages in Isaiah and Job but only the parts that suit his purpose. Isaiah was not “without purpose,” but he was struggling with the fact that while he was doing God’s will, no one seemed to be listening to his message. Isaiah was faithful, but he was discouraged by seeing little outward success. The rest of the verse in Isaiah 49:4 clearly shows that Isaiah was not questioning his purpose. In fact, he draws upon God for great comfort and encouragement. While Warren indicates that Isaiah had “no purpose” or was living “without meaning,” Isaiah actually says: “I have laboured in vain, I have spent my strength for nought, and in vain: yet surely my judgment is with the LORD, and my work with my God” (Isaiah 49:4). Warren failed to quote the whole verse. Isaiah commits the labor of his life to God by realizing it was God’s cause and work and God would reward him in due time. Isaiah 49:5 continues Isaiah’s encouraging words as he says: “Though Israel be not gathered, yet shall I be glorious in the eyes of the LORD, and my God shall be my strength.”

    Warren Smith in Deceived on Purpose insightfully writes: “Rick Warren could have wonderfully introduced hope and purpose through the godly lives of Isaiah and Job, but he chose to use them as examples of men who were without hope, purpose, or God in their lives. Instead, he used a New Age leader (Dr. Siegel) to preface his remarks about having a true hope that comes from having a 'deep sense of purpose.'” [Deceived on Purpose, p.51.]

    Rick Warren writes this: "Right now, God is inviting you to live for his glory by fulfilling the purposes he made you for.... Real life begins by committing yourself completely to Jesus Christ. If you are not sure you have done this, all you need to do is receive and believe...Will you accept God's offer? ....Wherever you are reading this, I invite you to bow your head and quietly whisper the prayer that will change your eternity: 'Jesus, I believe in you and I receive you.' Go ahead. If you sincerely meant that prayer, congratulations! Welcome to the family of God!"

    This teaching portrays God as dependent on the good will of men. If you will only "accept" Him, whatever that means, you are not only set for life, but for eternity. This is a gospel nowhere to be found in the Scriptures, whether in word or spirit. Consider the contrast with the actual words of the Christ, which declare His sovereignty and choosing of those to whom He will reveal Himself:

    "And He said to them, To you it is given to know the mystery of the Kingdom of God. But to those outside, all these things are given in parables so that seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them" (Mark 4:11-12).

    The only possibility of intimacy with Him is by His initiation. "No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him." (John 6:44) It is His doing to take a person through the process of salvation whereby that person becomes one with Him, and then does His works. And the first words of introduction are not a plea to accept Him, but a call to repent and turn away from one's own thoughts and ways, with a warning about the costs of following Him.

    These are just a few of the troubling aspects of the ministry of Rick Warren. Warren mocks Fundamentalism and has said, “There aren’t that many Fundamentalists left in America.” [From Pew Forum, May 23, 2005, “Myths of the Modern Mega Church,” an interview with Rick Warren, accessed July 1, 2008] Although Warren may interpret God’s blessing in terms of numbers, God never does. There were not many who were able to enter into Noah’s Ark. There were not many who accepted the prophetic statements of Isaiah or Jeremiah. There were not many following Jesus when He went to the cross. Nevertheless, there are still some very godly, balanced, loving, and doctrinally sound Biblical evangelicals and churches throughout our nation. Frankly, we are not living in a day of a new Reformation, but in the last days of perilous apostasy. Let us be wise, staying close to Jesus Christ in rightly dividing His Word until He comes again!

    F.B. Meyer said it well, “It is often argued that we should stay in the midst of churches and bodies whose sins and follies we deplore, in the hope of saving them for God and mankind. Such reasoning has a good deal of force in the first stages of decline. A strong protest may arrest error and stop the gangrene. But as time advances, and the whole body becomes diseased; when the protests have been disregarded, and the arguments trampled underfoot; when the majority have clearly taken up their position against the 'truth' we have no alternative but to come out and be separate. The place from which we can exert the strongest influence for good is not from within, but from without.”

  • #2
    Shame on anyone who vilifies a good, Godly man as Rick Warren!! I have been to his church, heard his preaching, read his books . . . God has used him to reach millions for Christ through his books! I am a Biblically trained scholar from Biola University, my friend, at one of the most astute & conservative Christian seminaries in the US. None of us condemn Rick Warren, but I do have Biblical confirmation about those who so freely condemn their Christian brothers! Something about a "log in one's own eye"!!
    Last edited by Jill; 06-17-2014, 04:05 AM.


    • #3
      No one has to vilify Rick, Jill. He promotes his own error openly and without apology. The real issue is, a large strata of Christendom needs a wakeup call. Half a truth is a lie, Satan's effective strategy since the beginning. Seduce the vulnerable (all of us) with truths combined with biblical manipulations, sufficient to lead astray the very elect as the Scripture vehemently warns.

      As Paul wrote in 2 Cor. 12:11, do I have to become a fool and gloat? I have credentials hanging in my pastors library, Bachelors and Doctorandus, Liberty University student from the 80's. What does all this academia really mean? What good is it to discourse profoundly on the Trinity but displease the Godhead for lacking humility and Godly wisdom? Even the very elect can and are seduced daily and even greater as the apostasy grows. "For it is time for judgment to begin at the household of God." 1 Peter 4:17 which counters the misuse of the "log in ones own eye" used to defend a challenged position.

      Instead Paul wisely writes, "For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you." I Cor. 11:19 and "Take no part in the unfruitful works of darkness, but instead expose them." and Eph. 5:11. "Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world." 1 John 4:1. "Do not judge by appearances, but judge with right judgment.” John 7:24... I simply don't find the post-modern ecumenical progressive teaching of "don't judge those in the house." It is simply unbiblical and part of the false spirit being promoted by the likes of Rick Warren. But then there is Bill Johnson and Bethel Church, even more spiritually profane than Rick Warren. It does not fail, that those seduced will follow camps of the same seduction. For people who choose the truth, it is like trying to beat a raging brush fire with a pillow case. "But evil men and seducers shall grow worse and worse: erring, and driving into error." 2 Tim. 3:13.


      • #4
        Have you sat in his church, listened to his teaching first-hand, met him, read "Purpose Driven Life" or listened to anyone who has been in his church? It's so easy to cast stones from afar or listen to those who consider themselves the Highly Discerning of all !!!, & in truth, it's just profound pride & arrogance w absolutely no love. Jesus says, "They will know we are Christians by our love!", not by the way we tear each other apart!!! Yes, we must have discernment, of course, but not w someone like Rick Warren. Who's next-Billy Graham?

        I'm sorry if I'm not being very loving here, but I can't stand this movement in the conservative body of Christ where we shred each other. I want no part of it!


        • #5
          That's another part of the false spirit that the Emergent e.g. Progressive church teaches, Jill. They play the "love" card as if everyone must be held dear, misguided leaders must be tolerated, sin winked at and as if all encompassing 'group hugs' are mandated from heaven. Again, this is unbiblical and I don't have the time or space to quote every verse that reveals what a dangerous deviation from Scripture that thinking represents, that same false teaching from the likes of Joel Osteen, Joyce Meyer and Joseph Prince.

          Modern evangelicals replace love for truth, and compromise for holiness. Yes, love is THE marker, the unity of the fellowship though the Spirit of God, among the TRUE brethren but that "love" never supplants God's truth or witness. Paul wrote the Corinthians in 5:11 instructing, "But now I am writing to you that you must not associate with anyone who claims to be a brother or sister but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or slanderer, a drunkard or swindler. Do not even eat with such people." There is other Scriptures that points out that we must "separate" from the unrepentant false among us. He highlights his thought with, "For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Do you not judge those who are within the church?" Again, punching another hole in the "judge not" philosophy found in unbiblical teachings like "Love Wins" by Rob Bell, a deviant book that focused on the "God is Love" chant misrepresented by the ecumenical church. "A little leaven leavens the whole lump of dough" is a phrased used more than one time, to warn us how a little tolerated sin will contaminate the whole spiritual body. That we are to immediately, without partiality, discard it. In the same manner that Ananias and Sapphira was stuck dead by the Holy Spirit as a sign for all generation.

          We cannot have it both ways, a tolerant God and a loving God. His holiness in love requires separation and exposure of what is false, "Therefore go out from their midst, and be separate from them, says the Lord, and touch no unclean thing; then I will welcome you." and this winnowing entails the use of the double edged sword that cuts the very core asunder. Even Jesus revealed this when he stated, "Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace, but a sword" Matt. 10:34.

          I am for unity and love, but this unity must be founded upon doctrinal truth. Jesus Himself said, “To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Everyone that is of the truth heareth my voice” (John 18:37). Jesus did not unify with the Jewish religious establishment of his day, or with the Roman political power. Rather, they crucified Him. Jesus Himself teaches us that His truth is paramount to any unity of man.

          As several discerning apologists have noted, Matthew 7:1 has replaced John 3:16, the same godless chant we hear from the LGBT crowd. The faith has become less about regeneration and more about toleration. The post-modern Church marches under Dominionism and Progressive Reconstructionism, details I doubt Biola University teaches, a banner that Rick Warren holds up high, garnered by accolades from world leaders. Dominion Theology, also called "Kingdom Now Theology," is a false teaching stating that man is commissioned to bring the entire world under the dominion of Christianity, by force if necessary, and then, hand over the Christianized world to Jesus when he comes. Islam moves under this same spirit as does the papacy of the Catholic church, a road lined in preparation for the anti-Christ. It is startling how the same agenda is perpetrated from different religious quarters. This fallacious teaching is largely the doctrine behind the "Purpose Driven Life". Global social works missions and rapid church planting is at the helm of this propaganda, which looks Godly and right when looking on, but empowered by a worldly wisdom, works righteousness unto justification in many cases. Not based on a sense of true holiness but the philosophy of moralism, global community, unification and transcendental enlightenment.

          Space here does not allow the pages and pages of data that proves explicitly and empirically, that Rick Warren is one of the ranking leaders of the apostate church. Truly, the candle stand (Holy Spirit) has been removed along time ago among his venues, and instead we see nonsense in charismania that has substituted the true Spirit. I referred to Bethel Church, which is firmly planted within the Word-Faith movement and within the Third Wave movement with its 'prophets,' 'apostles,' and other excesses, including strange manifestations. The false always comes in when the true departs, there is never a vacuum. The Spirit wrote expressly, in the letters to the church of Revelations, that any tolerance or departure from God's mandates (spiritual laws) would be dealt with swiftly and without warning. Not necessarily by an act of divine punishment, but by removal of His Spirit. The false will fester and grow, completely unaware how far it is from the mark, that is the nature of deception. So it is with those who are bound with blinders of this great seduction.


          • #6
            No, your tones lack any sense of humility or graciousness, and you presume to be " the elect" who save all the rest of us "ignorant ones" from hell itself! How arrogant! I believe if Jesus walked up to you today, you would reject Him b/c of His kindness to sinners! I cannot agree w anything you're saying or even the Scriptures you're using here to proof text your argument. The God of Christianity that I love would save people from damnation; not damn them to hell (as you are modeling). My God died on the cross for me; He didn't make a list of all the sinful beliefs I had -- which we all have, by the way!! Only the Pharisees & Sadducees did that!!! End of conversation for me!!


            • #7
              Many things combine to make the present inroad of false doctrine peculiarly dangerous.

              1. There is an undeniable zeal in some of the teachers of error: their “earnestness” makes many think they must be right.
              2. There is a great appearance of learning and theological knowledge: many fancy that such clever and intellectual men must surely be safe guides.
              3. There is a general tendency to free thought and free inquiry in these latter days: many like to prove their independence of judgment, by believing novelties.
              4. There is a wide-spread desire to appear charitable and liberal-minded: many seem half ashamed of saying that anybody can be in the wrong.
              5. There is a quantity of half-truth taught by the modern false teachers: they are incessantly using Scriptural terms and phrases in an unscriptural sense.
              6. There is a morbid craving in the public mind for a more sensuous, ceremonial, sensational, showy worship: men are impatient of inward, invisible heart-work.
              7. There is a silly readiness in every direction to believe everybody who talks cleverly, lovingly and earnestly, and a determination to forget that Satan often masquerades himself “as an angel of light” (2 Corinthians 11:14).
              8. There is a wide-spread “gullibility” among professing Christians: every heretic who tells his story plausibly is sure to be believed, and everybody who doubts him is called a persecutor and a narrow-minded man.
              All these things are peculiar symptoms of our times. I defy any observing person to deny them. They tend to make the assaults of false doctrine in our day peculiarly dangerous. They make it more than ever needful to cry aloud, “Do not be carried away!”
              ~ J.C. Ryle

              “What more common than to hear it said of some false teacher in this day:
              ‘He is so good, so devoted, so kind, so zealous, so laborious, so humble, so self-denying, so charitable, so earnest, so fervent, so clever, so evidently sincere, there can be no danger and no harm in hearing him. Besides he preaches so much real Gospel: no one can preach a better sermon than he does sometimes! I never can and never will believe he is unsound.’
              “Who does not hear continually such talk as this? What discerning eye can fail to see that many Churchmen expect unsound teachers to be open vendors of poison, and cannot realize that they often appear as ‘angels of light,’ and are far too wise to be always saying all they think, and showing their whole hand and mind. But so it is. Never was it so needful to remember the words, ‘The serpent beguiled Eve by his subtlety.’”
              ~ J.C. Ryle

              That old enemy of mankind, the devil, has no more subtle device for ruining souls than that of spreading false doctrine. Outside the church he is ever persuading men to maintain destructive superstitions. Like a pirate, his object is to “sink, burn and destroy.”
              Inside the church he is ever laboring to sow heresies, to propagate errors, to foster departures from the faith. If he cannot prevent the waters flowing from the Fountain of Life, he tries hard to poison them. If he cannot destroy the medicine of the Gospel, he strives to adulterate and corrupt it.
              ~ J.C. Ryle

              We have no right to expect anything but the pure Gospel of Christ, unmixed and unadulterated, the same Gospel that was taught by the Apostles, to do good to the souls of men. I believe that to maintain this pure truth in the Church—men should be ready to make any sacrifice, to hazard peace, to risk dissension, and run the chance of division. They should no more tolerate false doctrine—than they would tolerate sin. They should withstand any adding to or taking away from the simple message of the Gospel of Christ.
              ~ J.C. Ryle

              One plague of our age is the widespread dislike to what men are pleased to call dogmatic theology. In the place of it, the idol of the day is a kind of jellyfish Christianity – a Christianity without bone, or muscle, or sinew, – without any distinct teaching about the atonement or the work of the Spirit, or justification, or the way of peace with God – a vague, foggy, misty Christianity, of which the only watchwords seem to be, “You must be…liberal and kind. You must condemn no man’s doctrinal views. You must consider everybody is right and nobody is wrong.”
              ~ J.C. Ryle


              • #8
                I used to be a big Rick Warren fan until those more discerning than myself showed me the truth, much of which is below the radar. I have been to Rick Warren's church and read his book and was a fan. Actually my whole 'Christian' world was turned upside down about 8 years ago at a leadership summit when the last speaker gave the Barnum poles revealing the growing apostasy within the church and that only a small percent of "evangelicals" know God's Word, believe it and follow it. He challenged us to be faithful bereans, willing to contend for our faith against false doctrines infiltrating the church. I made a commitment that day that if I heard false teaching, I would confront it, not with my opinion but with God's Word which He has exalted above His name and is forever true.

                I know I had a knee-jerk reaction when I first heard that Rick Warren is a false teacher and it took much research to convince me. It's not about being self-righteous or wanting to put anyone down, it's just heart-breaking to see 'America's Pastor' in action, promoting a false gospel and leading so many other pastors and churches away from the only true gospel. It's a painful pill to swallow, but in a nutshell, he speaks out of all sides of his mouth depending on his audience whether it's with Obama, at the UN, CFR, etc. His global peace plan is void of the gospel and is about finding the 'man of peace' whether he be Hindu, Buddhist or Muslim etc. He supports the Common Word Document, the Manhattan Declaration, both ecumenical as well as Chrislam as if there is common ground with a religion that denies that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. The Bible calls that anti-Christ.

                He did a flip flop on Prop 8 and then lied about it and his latest Daniel Plan embraces all manner of new-age gurus and techniques such a meditation, yoga and reiki. As 'America's Pastor' he is responsible to preach the gospel but he does not. While he may give lip service by quoting scripture, it is often out of context and if you check his books and endorsements, he promotes many new-age ideas from his mentors such as Schuller and Drucker etc. His church growth success came not by following God's Word but by introducing the seeker-friendly, broad road approach by finding out what non believers want and serving it up including worldly music and focusing on felt needs while intentionally side stepping anything offensive such as sin, repentance and God's judgment.

                There is nothing more loving than sharing the truth which has eternal consequences for every soul. Preaching the true gospel is what caused the death of all the disciples save John who was spared to give us the vision of Revelation which is the final chapter of what is surely to come. However most churches today deny any kind of coming judgment and will set up the masses to follow the false Christ as scripture clearly warns. Jesus warned of spiritual deception, false teachers and false prophets. We are called to follow Him and not man. If anyone will objectively study the teachings of Rick Warren, they will find him to be false and there is nothing loving about teaching or following a false gospel.

                I encourage you Jill, to pray about it and do the research for yourself. Remember Jesus warned about spiritual deception more than anything else and satan rarely comes holding a pitchfork but masquerades as an angel of light or is dressed up in sheep's clothes. Jesus said, "Beware when all men speak well of you for such they did of the false prophets." Unfortunately he fits that bill. Acts 20:27-32
                Last edited by Susan; 06-18-2014, 09:50 PM.


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Jill View Post
                  The God of Christianity that I love would save people from damnation; not damn them to hell
                  The God of Christianity does not conform to our understanding of Him but to the revelation He left for us in the Scriptures--there is indeed condemnation for those who do not believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, He does make a difference between those who talk about Him and obey Him. Sadly, Rick Warren is good at talking but his fruits fall short. I recently read another very useful article that could complement very well what we are talking about here. It´s by Challies and he wrote it after he actually visited Saddleback Church. This is the link:

                  May the Lord open our eyes and ears to His truth, not our own understanding of things.


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